We chat with the collaborators about the new Energon Universe title and what it means to create a new Real American Hero.
Welcome to Creator Corner, our recurring interview series in which we chat with the coolest and most thought-provoking creators in the industry. In this entry, we're conversing with Joshua Williamson and Tom Reilly about GI Joe. Listen to the unedited audio HERE.
By now, hopefully, you've read the first issue of GI Joe, written by Joshua Williamson and illustrated by Tom Reilly. You've seen the last two pages, those that were redacted from review copies. You have a strong feeling about them. However, we're not here to talk about you-know-what happening to you-know-who.
Joshua Williamson and Tom Reilly return to Comic Book Couples Counseling, nearly a year after their previous visit, to discuss launching the Energon Universe's GI Joe and, specifically, what it means to create a new Joe from thin air. We're talking Risk, the electric-knuckled, John Wick-inspired, Winchester-blasting, brand-new Real American Hero. While we wait for him to collide with team leader Duke, we're eager to discuss his creation, his purpose, and just how hard he was to get past Hasbro.
If you think our Brad contemplates action figures a lot, you have not yet dipped into Joshua Williamson's brain. Nobody loves Hasbro's soldiers as much as this guy, and he has the perfect partner in crime with artist Tom Reilly. These two spent hours staring at the Joe lineup, contemplating Sgt. Slaughter, The Fridge, and Big Boa, before they found the courage to create their own battle-ready hero.
This conversation has been edited for clarity and length.
Joshua Williamson, Tom Reilly, and GI Joe Take a Risk
Brad: The last time we had you both on, we ended that conversation going like, "Gosh, what are you going to do next? Introduce Golobulus." And Joshua, you were pretty like, "Well, I'm really looking forward to you reading Cobra Commander." And damn, you guys did it!"
Joshua Williamson: Yeah, well, we like to keep our secrets. That's the thing. We're all trying to keep secrets, and you guys always tap into stuff. You always get real close.
Brad: Well, let's see how we do this time. Where we want to start this conversation is with a character that you introduce in GI Joe #1. You have so many toys to play with already. You've talked about how they line your office walls there, the Classified figures, and yet you introduce Risk, a new character to the franchise. Why?
Joshua Williamson: Well, again, I like toys, and it's really awesome to build new toys. Working at DC and working on things like Flash and Superman, Batman and Robin and all that. It's always way more fun to add than to take away. It's always so much more fun to build than to break. And don't get me wrong, we break characters down, but I always think it's fun to add these elements and see how they change. I said this in New York, too, and this kind of goes back to even just the creation of the Energon Universe, but sometimes these stories, these pathologies, they become these ponds, and the ponds sort of become quiet, and level, and then you want to throw pebbles into it and see what happens, the ripple effects.
And to really do that, you have to bring in new stuff. It can't always be the same thing. You got to bring in new things. So, really early on, it was like, "Okay, we're going to make a new GI Joe, but then how is he different?" That was the whole conversation about making him different from the rest. And having those toys in my office helped with that, because I would just stand over here, at this one shelf over here, and I would just stare at the toys and be like, "How do we make sure he is different from everybody else, not just visually but personality. How do I make his story, his backstory, all of that? How do I separate him from what is here?" Because they're here. In the first issue there's that moment where Hawk is explaining to Duke, "I don't need another one of you. We have you." We need to make them the best versions of them, but that diversity will make them strong.
I think that's really part of what's true about GI Joe in general. Looking back at what Larry Hama built, all the characters are unique and different. Part of what was so fun about that property as a kid was how different those characters were. So, all of that went into the math, like, "Well, we're going to bring somebody in. They got to be super different from everybody else." And that was what started leading the conversations about Risk. Me texting Tom ideas of we're going to make a new person and this is sort of where the basis of that person was going to come out of. But I always like to add new stuff to the toy box.
Tom Reilly: There's hundreds of weird, crazy GI Joe characters and every one of those characters is always somebody's favorite.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah.
Tom Reilly: He's got a parrot on his shoulder, Shipwreck.
Joshua Williamson: Shipwreck, for sure.
Tom Reilly: Sergeant Slaughter's a real guy who just was just thrown in. The Fridge is in GI Joe-
Joshua Williamson: Yeah, another real person.
Tom Reilly: From The Bears and just crazy.
Joshua Williamson: But they had a basketball player; they had Chuckles.
Tom Reilly: GI Joe may be the best property to introduce a new character, because there's so many crazy, interesting characters already. And like Josh said, they're all unique. So, to be able to add to that pantheon of craziness is a very cool opportunity.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah.
Joshua Williamson, Tom Reilly, and the GI Joe Look
Brad: And Tom, what is involved in creating a new GI Joe? How do you feel about creating a new character versus redesigning or enhancing classic GI Joes?
Tom Reilly: It is different because you're building it from the ground up. Josh gives me an idea of something that he wants. He wanted a GI Joe character to be in a suit. There are no GI Joe characters who are suited.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah.
Tom Reilly: And I looked through it, and he was right. You can't really count Hawk when he's in his general outfit.
Joshua Williamson: No.
Tom Reilly: That doesn't really count.
Joshua Williamson: That's a uniform.
Tom Reilly: There's no dapper GI Joe beating people up. He gives me a little backstory. He's a CIA operative, he's a cage fighter, things like this, his ethnicity. I just go in, and I do various, copious amounts of research, really, trying to get a cool character design down and give him a cool gimmick. He's got those boxing gloves that are kind of high-tech. He's got the sweet, big eagle belt. That's a cool accessory. He wanted him to have a sweet, really decked-out gun. I gave him the Winchester lever-action rifle just because that's the coolest gun ever.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah.
Tom Reilly: So, it enhances the dude's cool factor.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah, we wanted to make sure he came from money. There are little clues to that that. You can see this by how he's dressed and by the fact that that gun is gold-plated. It's these little touches.
Tom Reilly: You think about him in context to the story, too. That went into his design. He is a foil to Duke in the story. Our Duke is tall, big, and strong; Risk is a little smaller and wirier. He's a little rougher, a little tougher looking than Duke, who's more clean-cut at this point. So, it's a visual difference as well as a writing difference that Josh is putting in.
Joshua Williamson: We knew they wouldn't like each other, so that was part of it. It's funny, it's like I just unload all this information on Tom and then Tom filters it through, and actually puts the extra level of thought into it. That's the thing with Risk. His design was intended to tell you a story when you look at him.
The hope is that they will make a toy of Risk. That he becomes a permanent fixture, part of the mythology, but also - here's the important about introducing Risk. At no time was Risk going to become the main character. That happens a lot of times when people, they introduce a new character and suddenly it becomes about the new character. And I was like, "No, no, no. I don't want to do that." We have plans going on - I think we're not doing a standalone story with him. I don't think we're doing anything with him. It's a standalone mythology until we get into the 30s, I think. It might even be the early 40s, in terms of issues.
So, it's going to be a while. They didn't want it to be like, "Oh, boom. It's all about him and his history." It's fun when Wolverine was introduced to the X-Men, how it wasn't always about him, but then you watch the first X-Men movie, which is a Wolverine story. I did not want to go down that path. I wanted to make sure that it was still Duke's book; it's still a team book about the Joes. Risk is this new element. How he causes conflict and clashes and creates story for the book.
Joshua Williamson, Tom Reilly, GI Joe, and Hasbro's Say-So
Brad: And do you have to get approval from Hasbro when you introduce a character like this?
Joshua Williamson: We have to get everything approved by Hasbro. Everything. Every little thing. But the thing about that is that they have been awesome. They're so supportive and excited about everything they're doing. They love all of Tom's designs. They love everything that we're doing. They're really happy and have been so super supportive. I remember when we just announced it - they know about it, obviously. Everything goes through them; every little piece of art goes through them. The first time I met them was right after we announced everything at San Diego Comic-Con, and it was like the beginning stages of a relationship, at least in terms of knowing me. They knew Robert [Kirkman] and Sean [Mackiewicz], but not me and Daniel [Warren Johnson]. One of the head designers for Hasbro, who also goes through all this stuff, looked at everything, he was like, "Oh, cool."
He was very open about sharing things. He showed me some stuff. It was a very casual, nice conversation. This was almost two years ago. This was way before we had shown anything. Not really any art had got out there yet. We're talking about six months before Duke #1 had been out, I mean publicly. So then this past San Diego Comic-Con, when I saw them again, this is again: Duke's already come out, Cobra Commander is already out, and all the issues are out. We're fully driving in at GI Joe #1 now. I saw the guy, and he was doing the booth duty, talking to fans and people. He saw me and he goes, "My fucking guy," and ran over and gave me a hug and stuff, and was so happy, and he was just pumped about the stuff we're doing.
I always think about this. A lot of times, the difference between create-your-own and working on people's properties is you are babysitting. That is not your kid. And so anything that's not your kid, you double check with those parents, but again, they've been so incredibly supportive. I mean, it's nuts. I said this earlier: I don't want to jinx us, Tom.
Tom Reilly: No, don't.
Joshua Williamson: They feel good about everything, so I'm still knocking on wood. But they've been great. So something like that with Risk, it is like this is all the information. Here's all the stuff we're doing. Here's Tom's designs, and they've just been like, "You're good to go. That's awesome. Go."
Tom Reilly: That design went through the first try.
Joshua Williamson: Yeah, first try.
Tom Reilly: That doesn't happen a lot.
Joshua Williamson: No.
Tom Reilly: All these GI Joe designs have gone through pretty much the first try. I think there was maybe one that I had to do some editing on.
Joshua Williamson: It's like 99%. I think they've just been like, "Go."
Tom Reilly: That does not happen, especially with a company this big.
Joshua Williamson: This property.
Tom Reilly: Where they sell toys and stuff. They want the visuals to be on point.
Joshua Williamson: When we named him Risk, we and them were like, "How was there never a character named that?" We all were simultaneously like, "Oh, my God, you're kidding me." And it totally fits his character.
Meet Risk in GI Joe #1, which is now on sale from Image Comics, Skybound Entertainment, and Hasbro.
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