We chat with the writer about the DC series and mirroring her favorite heroes with her favorite villains.
Welcome to Creator Corner, our recurring interview series in which we chat with the industry's coolest and most thought-provoking creators. In this entry, we're conversing about Secret Six with Nicole Maines. Listen to the unedited audio HERE.
Arriving in shops on March 5th, Secret Six #1 promises a righteous, fresh take on the gnarly DC cult classic. Written by Nicole Maines and illustrated by Stephen Segovia, the six-issue limited series smashes "heroes" Jon Kent, Jay Nakamura, and Nia Nal with "villains" Black Alice, Catman, and Deadshot. Amanda Waller has escaped her cell post-Absolute Power, and only this cantankerous team can track her down and solve the mystery of her disappearance.
We spoke with Nicole Mains about her approach toward these teammates and how Secret Six has always excelled in combustible relationships. Maines is a writer who loves to put her characters through a guantlet, and she's seemingly most happy when they're the most miserable. We dive into this devilish delight and explore how Secret Six could flip the roles and philosophies of these well-established heroes and villains.
This conversation was edited for length and clarity.
Nicole Maines, Secret Six, and Mirror, Mirror, On the Wall.
Brad: Gosh, Secret Six. We just read the first issue this morning. It's an incredible setup. What a team! The idea of mirroring Jay, Nia and Jon with Black Alice, Catman and Deadshot is brilliant.
Nicole Maines: Thank you.
Brad: Talk a little bit more about bringing those six together.
Nicole Maines: Yeah, it's a weird lineup. I know. Because this is the thing, too. Originally, I wanted to do my own team, but the Secret Six is, first of all, so iconic. And in reading the original Secret Six, well, not the original Secret Six, but the critically acclaimed 2005 and 2008 runs, it's like I wanted to make sure there were at least half the team members that were part of the original Six too, because obviously it's a Secret Six book. But I feel like Jay and Jon and Nia, who feel like at this point my children, and I'm like, they're terrible, abusive, wicked stepmother.
I say stepmother because some of their real moms are dead. Some recently, some less so, both Nia's Fault. They feel like they're at such a pivotal turning point in the wake of Absolute Power in one that feels organically similar to Black Alice and Deadshot and Catman, all of these characters who at first tried to be good and tried to do good things and still do try to be good-ish people, but they're just so good at making the wrong decision and so good at being bad. And our three heroes find themselves in that position now as well.
Jon's always been afraid that he's a monster, and that's always been, ever since he accidentally killed Goldie the cat, he's been like, "Oh, I'm clearly destined to be a monster." And then Amanda Waller made him one, and now he's like, "Nope, everything's normal. Everything's fine. That's over. That's over. That's over. That's over. That's over. I'm fine." And then he's going to go home to his boyfriend and he's going to bring the takeout and everything's going to be normal, but it's not normal because my boyfriend is spinning the fuck out.
He is just at the beginning of this downward spiral into vengeance and anger and blame and bitterness, and quite frankly, who could blame him because of the whole situation we had with Henry Bendix Remember that? And it basically just happened immediately after again. This time with Amanda Waller, who I would say is infinitely worse.
Lisa: Yes.
Nicole Maines: So he doesn't know what to do, and Dreamer is at the center of it all. She never really had a choice. She's only ever tried to do the right things per her vision, and she's tried to steer the flow of time into one where the future will be good. That's at the end of the graphic novel Bad Dream. She's like, "I'm just going to try to fight for a future I can be proud of." And boy, that just crashed and burned over and over and over again. But also, how could she? She never had a chance to be a superhero, even just at the street level.
She was immediately thrust into this whole drama with Henry Bendix and the revolution, the first revolution of Gamorra, and then she found herself in Lazarus Planet, went through the Helmet of Fate, submerged in a fucking Lazarus volcano, then Beast World. "Okay, we're going to save all of these aliens, and we're going to bring them to my refugee town, where they're going to be safe. Oh wait, I was just putting more chickens in the coop for Amanda Waller to come and threaten with doxing in a very vitriolic anti-alien time."
And she gets blackmailed into working with Amanda Waller, and she's like, "Yeah, I can manage this. I can keep on top of this." No, you can't, bitch. It's Amanda Waller. Amanda Waller always wins. And then Absolute Power happens. So, she's always tried to do the right thing, and it's just so spectacularly crashed and burned and everything's her fault. Is it? Yes and no.
Nicole Maines, Secret Six, and Superman's Shadow
Lisa: The stakes now are so high for all of their mental health.
Nicole Maines: Or what's left of it.
Lisa: Yeah, it's about rebuilding trust. They're trying to build this team, but at the same time, they have all lost trust in themselves, their judgment, and trust in each other, particularly those coming from the "I'm on the good team. I am not a bad guy." Despite all of the evidence to the contrary.
Nicole Maines: Yeah. They're like, "What's that mountain of flaming rubble behind you?" Don't look at that. That's nothing.
Lisa: Right, where you're supposed to exude this confidence. They have been completely drained as a team.
Nicole Maines: Yeah. And the thing is, they've done, especially Jay, he's done all the things that you're supposed to do. He's done the protests, he's marched, he's used his voice in a public legal way and more of a cyber-terrorry anonymous way, and he's exhausted all nonviolent means of seeking justice and change and to be a hero. Now he finds himself at this point where he is like, "Who am I protecting, and who am I? Like, I guess it really doesn't matter. I guess nothing really matters." He's in such a nihilistic state, and who could blame him after watching everything that's happened to him?
And Jon is just so desperate to be like, "No, I am the son of Superman. I am good and my friends are good and we're going to be good." But that's hard to do when you're standing opposite the Secret Six and Deadshot's chain-smoking cigarettes. And he is like, "Yeah, whatever you tell yourself, Princess."
Lisa: It's so hard to watch Jay just not trust Jon anymore with his own safety, and he feels betrayed that Jon would ally with Nia again. In this whole first issue, this tension cannot be addressed because of the sense of urgency around the situation.
Nicole Maines: Yes.
Lisa: And I love and hate to watch that get pent up and withheld.
Nicole Maines: Yeah, that's definitely not going to explode, right? That's definitely not a ticking time bomb.
Brad: One of the things we love so much about your writing is that you seemingly love to drag your characters.
Nicole Maines: I do like to break my toys, don't I?
Nicole Maines Loves to Hurt the Secret Six.
Brad: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Can you talk about putting them through hell?
Nicole Maines: I mean, I think the answer is drama. Make comic books soap operas again. You know what I mean? Nobody wants to read a story where everyone always makes the right decision and everyone's okay at the end of every episode. And frankly, I think I've done that version of Dreamer. We did that on the show. It was very like, okay, this is 8:00 PM on a Sunday, easily digestible family show, and everyone will be okay. And I wanted to make sure in the comics it's like, "Well, let's do the opposite of that, and let's make sure everyone is vehemently not okay at all times and see where that leads us."
I think it brings us into these cool, interesting places where you have the son of Superman who's trying to live up to his father's ideals, but now, through his own traumatic experiences, he's perhaps drawing a different conclusion, and he has his boyfriend who's like, "Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, fight for the American way. But just so you know, the American way is imperialism, colonialism, and exploitation of marginalized people."
Brad: Yeah.
Nicole Maines: "So fight for that, babe."
Brad: What I see in Secret Six and your past writing is an exploration of what heroism is when winning isn't happening. What does it mean to be a hero in 2025?
Nicole Maines: Well, I think we're seeing a lot of that in the zeitgeist too. I think most famously right now, Wicked, we're seeing that. There's being nice and being popular and being adored and being good, and there's being right and there's actually doing the right thing and actually sacrificing what little you have to stand on the side of justice and progress. And no, I recognize that the powers that be are playing a big role in the pain that we're all feeling, and I don't want to be a part of that. I don't want to protect those institutions.
But also, does that make me a villain? Now, does that make me like these guys? Cut to Deadshot chain-smoking, and he is like, "Yes."
Secret Six #1 arrives in local comic shops on March 5th. And don't forget, you can listen to this unedited conversation on the CBCC Patreon.
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